Oh, it's a kindness to spare his wife having to bear a child, but let some other woman do it - she doesn't matter. But, like you say, maybe it's a fake account.
You mention Satan worship - there is a WHOLE lot of that going on. It probably has been for a long time, but now is bubbling to the surface.
I've been thinking recently about how societal pressures/norms are slowly making women less and less competent at, well, being women. For example, a couple I know (both with full-time jobs) recently went to a "Parent/Teacher Conference" for their 6 month-old hosted by their daycare. There's obviously a lot we could say about why that's preposterous, but I keep thinking about how many moms I know who seem to have conceded their rightful place as "mother." Husband and wife share equally the duty of giving the baby a bottle. Dad attends every single well check-up with the mom and baby. Both mother and father have the same app on their phones where they track the baby's growth, number of wet diapers produced, and ounces of milk consumed...the list goes on. Then in the home, all duties are shared equally. And by that I mean, neither person really *knows* how to cook meals from real ingredients rather than just warm something up. Neither person really *knows* what needs to be done to clean a bathroom. Neither person really *knows* if the baby is getting sick because she's unusually fussy, feels a little warm, and hasn't been nursing well. In the end, the duties aren't shared equally...it just seems to me that the mom has lost her special place as the heart of the home. She concedes it - perhaps without ever realizing it was meant to be hers. Obviously surrogacy is outright evil for other reasons, but also, think of what the mother loses by conceding the chance to carry a child in her womb, to birth him and nurse him at her breast, and to know him more intimately (at least when he's very little) than anyone else on the planet? What a tragedy.
A mother is convinced to pump breastmilk, but somehow can't seem even to give the bottle to her own baby-- dad has to step in and do it.
Women are fast becoming quite inept at everything.
I am convinced that one reason women are okay with surrogacy is that they don't like sex. Of course, contraception and a husband deep in pornography do make it quite unattractive!
Years ago I had a wonderfully dotty English professor. Our main focus of the semester was The Great Gatsby, but to get the full effect, he had to sum up all of human history and philosophy to set the context, I suppose. One of the major factors that changed the world, according to him, was vulcanized rubber, in its importance to the war efforts, but even more for one invention: the rubber nipple. Suddenly women had detachable breasts, and could be released into the world to do all sorts of things. I remember him acting out a mother detaching her breasts, and yelling out the front door to a stranger on the street, "Hey you! Feed this baby so I can go be liberated!" He was very theatrical, students either loved or hated him, and probably the sort of wise-fool needed to call the world to task.
Maybe I should write about my three little-known causes of societal breakdown (to add to the known ones everyone talks about). One is definitely bottle-feeding.
Not only does it detach the mother from the child and the child from the mother -- it consigns her to having a baby every year... unless... she takes... birth control! (by the way, another use for rubber was... condoms! yay war!)
The drugs that are a routine part of the IVF process make women feel “crazy” according to two friends of mine that have tried such. We need to talk about the harm that does in a home, month after month after month.
A fairly fundamentalist friend of mine recently posted on FB her daughter and husband were finally expecting after IVF treatments. (And having done other fertility treatments previously) I just could not bring myself to "like" the post. I can celebrate a baby, but not the method of conception.
Also, in a waiting room I picked up a magazine that had a smiling Tara Lipinski with her daughter on the cover. The whole article was about her surrogacy experience because she just couldn't carry a child apparently. (She was a big deal in the 90's Catholic world because she wore a St. Therese medal, etc...and proudly professed her faith) While I sympathize with her plight, I was aghast at her solution. We are so awash in a culture of cutting corners that the cross is truly still scandalous. Who among us would choose to carry such burdens if we could justify the means for easing them, if not for love of God? It starts with small things... a little artificial BC here, bottle feeding for convenience, pre-scheduled c-sections so posh ladies don't have to "push", ("too posh to push" is a thing), etc...
We want a perfect home to prove we can control everything that goes on in our home - babies only when/if we want because we are in control. Nothing uncontrolled, nothing greater than us and our power.
It is very sad, and oftentimes hard, to admit that some of our deepest desires are simply out of our control. Do Americans have a particularly difficult time with this, due to that deep-seated sense of Protestant work ethic? We cannot demand babies. We cannot welcome children (or husbands???) into our homes and expect them to look like no one lives there.
I actually think it's all a defense mechanism brought on by the extreme aggression of birth control and porn -- men actually out of control but in a socially acceptable way, so what recourse do women have?
That last paragraph brings to mind the very much discussed surrogacies of Paris Hilton, whose reason for the utilization of this “resource” wasn’t infertility but simply fear of childbirth. I would argue that the pain and suffering that typically does occur with birth is absolutely purposeful, in the sense that it reflects something back to us about ourselves and our own strength. That reflection, and the integration of that reflection, helps us as we move through the early days of the postpartum time and for years to come. Bypassing the tackling of that experience via paying another woman to do it for you is a sort of bypassing of motherhood initiation, especially for someone with that specific fear.
I’ve struggled with infertility AND have adopted 4 kids. Adoption isn’t an infertility treatment. It’s not right for everyone, it has to be done in a trauma informed & child centered way, AND it doesn’t take away the pain or longing of infertility. Is it less weird to desire to have a biological child or to take a child from their parents?
I understand the caution and concern, but know that many people do use IVF out of a place of abundance of love and wanting to have a baby. Fertility rates are declining, even in those who didn’t marry late. I’m 29 and I’ve seen more and more people my age or younger struggle with fertility, miscarriages, and needing medical miracles to grow their families. I have concerns around some of the ethics of IVF, but I know many amazing Christian couples who have brought children into the world that way through so much prayer and effort.
So while I agree with your premise that outsourcing it all is a troubling trend, I think the villainizing of IVF is an oversimplification.
Porn indeed drives all of this.
IVF is the same as prostitution - objectifying and commodifying the female body by separating love from procreation.
Oh, it's a kindness to spare his wife having to bear a child, but let some other woman do it - she doesn't matter. But, like you say, maybe it's a fake account.
You mention Satan worship - there is a WHOLE lot of that going on. It probably has been for a long time, but now is bubbling to the surface.
I've been thinking recently about how societal pressures/norms are slowly making women less and less competent at, well, being women. For example, a couple I know (both with full-time jobs) recently went to a "Parent/Teacher Conference" for their 6 month-old hosted by their daycare. There's obviously a lot we could say about why that's preposterous, but I keep thinking about how many moms I know who seem to have conceded their rightful place as "mother." Husband and wife share equally the duty of giving the baby a bottle. Dad attends every single well check-up with the mom and baby. Both mother and father have the same app on their phones where they track the baby's growth, number of wet diapers produced, and ounces of milk consumed...the list goes on. Then in the home, all duties are shared equally. And by that I mean, neither person really *knows* how to cook meals from real ingredients rather than just warm something up. Neither person really *knows* what needs to be done to clean a bathroom. Neither person really *knows* if the baby is getting sick because she's unusually fussy, feels a little warm, and hasn't been nursing well. In the end, the duties aren't shared equally...it just seems to me that the mom has lost her special place as the heart of the home. She concedes it - perhaps without ever realizing it was meant to be hers. Obviously surrogacy is outright evil for other reasons, but also, think of what the mother loses by conceding the chance to carry a child in her womb, to birth him and nurse him at her breast, and to know him more intimately (at least when he's very little) than anyone else on the planet? What a tragedy.
Yes, all such good observations.
A mother is convinced to pump breastmilk, but somehow can't seem even to give the bottle to her own baby-- dad has to step in and do it.
Women are fast becoming quite inept at everything.
I am convinced that one reason women are okay with surrogacy is that they don't like sex. Of course, contraception and a husband deep in pornography do make it quite unattractive!
It is so very sad.
Years ago I had a wonderfully dotty English professor. Our main focus of the semester was The Great Gatsby, but to get the full effect, he had to sum up all of human history and philosophy to set the context, I suppose. One of the major factors that changed the world, according to him, was vulcanized rubber, in its importance to the war efforts, but even more for one invention: the rubber nipple. Suddenly women had detachable breasts, and could be released into the world to do all sorts of things. I remember him acting out a mother detaching her breasts, and yelling out the front door to a stranger on the street, "Hey you! Feed this baby so I can go be liberated!" He was very theatrical, students either loved or hated him, and probably the sort of wise-fool needed to call the world to task.
That's awesome!! Truly!
Maybe I should write about my three little-known causes of societal breakdown (to add to the known ones everyone talks about). One is definitely bottle-feeding.
Not only does it detach the mother from the child and the child from the mother -- it consigns her to having a baby every year... unless... she takes... birth control! (by the way, another use for rubber was... condoms! yay war!)
And we're off to the races.
The other two are for another day...
The drugs that are a routine part of the IVF process make women feel “crazy” according to two friends of mine that have tried such. We need to talk about the harm that does in a home, month after month after month.
A fairly fundamentalist friend of mine recently posted on FB her daughter and husband were finally expecting after IVF treatments. (And having done other fertility treatments previously) I just could not bring myself to "like" the post. I can celebrate a baby, but not the method of conception.
Also, in a waiting room I picked up a magazine that had a smiling Tara Lipinski with her daughter on the cover. The whole article was about her surrogacy experience because she just couldn't carry a child apparently. (She was a big deal in the 90's Catholic world because she wore a St. Therese medal, etc...and proudly professed her faith) While I sympathize with her plight, I was aghast at her solution. We are so awash in a culture of cutting corners that the cross is truly still scandalous. Who among us would choose to carry such burdens if we could justify the means for easing them, if not for love of God? It starts with small things... a little artificial BC here, bottle feeding for convenience, pre-scheduled c-sections so posh ladies don't have to "push", ("too posh to push" is a thing), etc...
At the root of all of this is control, of course.
We want a perfect home to prove we can control everything that goes on in our home - babies only when/if we want because we are in control. Nothing uncontrolled, nothing greater than us and our power.
It is very sad, and oftentimes hard, to admit that some of our deepest desires are simply out of our control. Do Americans have a particularly difficult time with this, due to that deep-seated sense of Protestant work ethic? We cannot demand babies. We cannot welcome children (or husbands???) into our homes and expect them to look like no one lives there.
I actually think it's all a defense mechanism brought on by the extreme aggression of birth control and porn -- men actually out of control but in a socially acceptable way, so what recourse do women have?
The consequence of the war of all against all :(
That last paragraph brings to mind the very much discussed surrogacies of Paris Hilton, whose reason for the utilization of this “resource” wasn’t infertility but simply fear of childbirth. I would argue that the pain and suffering that typically does occur with birth is absolutely purposeful, in the sense that it reflects something back to us about ourselves and our own strength. That reflection, and the integration of that reflection, helps us as we move through the early days of the postpartum time and for years to come. Bypassing the tackling of that experience via paying another woman to do it for you is a sort of bypassing of motherhood initiation, especially for someone with that specific fear.
IVF blocks a very natural solution to crisis pregnancy which is adoption.
American solidarity party, Green shoot though it is, is looking better by the day. RIP GOP
I’ve struggled with infertility AND have adopted 4 kids. Adoption isn’t an infertility treatment. It’s not right for everyone, it has to be done in a trauma informed & child centered way, AND it doesn’t take away the pain or longing of infertility. Is it less weird to desire to have a biological child or to take a child from their parents?
I understand the caution and concern, but know that many people do use IVF out of a place of abundance of love and wanting to have a baby. Fertility rates are declining, even in those who didn’t marry late. I’m 29 and I’ve seen more and more people my age or younger struggle with fertility, miscarriages, and needing medical miracles to grow their families. I have concerns around some of the ethics of IVF, but I know many amazing Christian couples who have brought children into the world that way through so much prayer and effort.
So while I agree with your premise that outsourcing it all is a troubling trend, I think the villainizing of IVF is an oversimplification.
Feels like you didn't read anything I wrote.
IVF is a dystopian fraud, preying on those who are really suffering, and creating a lot more suffering.
Don't leverage people's real sadness, prayers, and good will to normalize something truly bad.